W 2-0 vs Gillingham (H) - League Two - Sat 18th March, 3pm

What I always find funny though is that Dan from Walsall doesn’t need stats to tell him what his eyes can see but Pep Guardiola, Klopp, Mourinho et al will all use them extensively to help guide them in forming an opinion or making a decision. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

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No one said you had to be converted. You asked for the stat and I gave it to you. After that it’s up to you, but I kind of knew it was t going to convince you of anything. Which is fine btw :+1:

I asked the question because on that stat Hutchinson would rank 23 out of the 40 players shown on the picture, that would indicate out of those 40 he is below average when compared. I am only basing it on the description provided, but I think as @el_nombre pointed out, no one is saying Hutchinson is a bad player, but recognising the inconsistency, which this stat May point to.

If he can produce those figures with that inconsistency at present, just think what he can produce if/when that improves. We will have a hell of a player on our hands and I hope he has the mentality to keep working hard to improve. Walsall is littered with examples of young players who looked like they possessed talent only to not apply themselves and face the trapdoor of a career in non-league. I don’t think Hutchinson is one of them and he is in the driving seat of that in terms of where his future career takes him (hopefully success with us :grinning::crossed_fingers:t2:).

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Nail on head :+1:t2:

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Someone who has a good understanding of a subject can benefit from stats if they understand how to use them.

If you do not know how to use the stats, or perhaps misunderstand them and misuse them, then the effect of using stats to change policy is likely to be negative

This is true in football and in many other subjects such as economics, politics, education and science.

I would say that in football the use of stats only adds a very small amount over that which an expert observer gets from watching a player - but that at the top level the best coaches are always looking to make small changes which can give their teams the edge.

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Some fair points.

Worth noting though that the index will be relative to the the team you play for and how much possession you have or don’t have, especially if your source or points is based on in possession work…

Bear in mind these are the top 40 so 23rd in the top 40 from 200 midfield players is different to 23rd out of just 40 players……

Also we don’t really know the differential between a few points or how it’s established….relative to being marked out of 10 it could be the difference between 221 (highest) and 200 could be the equivalent of the difference between 9 and 8.5.

We don’t know. Which is another reason why the ratings in stats sites are more arbitrary than the actual stats.

Walsalls index as a team is 195….

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Agreed, as many have said there are so many variables in football you have to take a rounded view of everything and draw you own conclusions.

One point of order, it is the top 40 ranked on goals and assists so is skewed, be interesting to see where Hutchinson comes out if you ranked that index on all 200 odd midfielders.

I’ll take a look later.

While I don’t really pay much attention to the index….same on team of the week, sometimes it’s nonsense….here is the Walsall squad ranking and there must be some logic to it as I think most people would be hard pushed to look beyond Manny and Donervon as our best two performers and Riley aside (he hasn’t enough minutes for his index to be a fair reflection) I think most would be pressed to argue with Knowles and Hutchinson as the next two?

Think Evans is in with a shout of being amongst our top 5 performers.

Maddox also. Think he’s been outstanding to be honest. Does a lot of dirty work and very rarely wastes the ball as, say, Comley has at times this season. I still think him and one other should be the midfield two (Kinsella for me, but Comley is going through his best run of form of the season).

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Oh that’s an interesting ranking :eyes::eyes::eyes:

What point? I was explaining that I don’t like all these algorithms, that’s all. Don’t get your knickers in a twist because I don’t like these stats you always seem to rely. I don’t like them, you do. And that’s fine :slightly_smiling_face:

I think you’re missing the point a little.

Dan from Walsall IS watching Walsall every game, judging one set of players on a forum amongst mostly like minded people where there’s debate and discussion.

Dan from Walsall ISN’T trying to sign a winger where I need to compare my clubs weaknesses against players from all around Europe.

The point is it doesn’t matter if you like them or not. That’s entirely up to you. What I said was your opinion is your opinion all the stats may or may not so is make your opinion more informed. It may or may not change it that’s irrelevant, but what it won’t do is make your opinion less informed.

I don’t rely on them. Again that’s my point. I look at them to make my opinion more informed than it may be if I didn’t look at them. It still won’t make my opinion right or wrong but it does give me a chance of have a more valid or stronger argument for or against something. It’s just some additional info. No different to me and you having an opinion on the holocaust but I’ve read nothing on it while you’ve studied documents, read books and watched documentaries. It’s still my opinion but yours would be a more informed one.

Godwins law comes in right there :joy::joy:

Again you’ve missed the point and think that top managers are only using analytics for recruitment purposes only.

They will also look at all sorts of info in order to make their decisions more informed when tailoring coaching sessions, improving individuals and even picking sides. Now whilst I understand no one on here has any interest in doing that, it does highlight that or will be used to help determine who’s doing their jobs and who isnt rather than just watching the game once, after a few beers, 5 piss breaks, two burgers and several renditions of “she wore a yellow ribbon” while looking at the opposition supporters!! :joy::joy:

Sorry but this now needs a poll as to how people would rather watch a Walsall game :smiley:

  • Review lots of information to make an informed view on the game
  • Watch the game once, after a few beers, 5 piss breaks, two burgers and several renditions of “she wore a yellow ribbon” while looking at the opposition supporters

0 voters

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It’s slowly turning into the Football equivalent of the Covid thread :man_facepalming:

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There are 288 midfield players ranked using this index for mileages two.

Top rank is 225 and lowest is 160.

There are lots of players on the same rank and so in total there are 71 players ranked between 225 (Hussey at Stockport) and 203 (Hutchinson) but allowing for players on the same he is ranked 21st highest from 288 players.

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Follow the science :grinning:

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Is he our highest ? Just interested where our other ones come in?

It’s all the Kinspiracy Theorists.

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We are only talking about one player :rofl: it’s odd